And this is Working with Internet Explorer, written , and concerning Rants, Web, and Software
Building HTA desktop apps with Internet Explorer is a real treat for a web developer. You get to work with desktop features such as native drag and drop, system icons, reading and writing files, encrypted SQL server embedded databases, and chrome-less, non-rectangular windows (even with HTML!). You also have access to all of the features of Windows, the most popular operating system in the world, like audio and video, sound transforms, uploads and downloads, byte arrays, cryptography, and loads more. Best of all, you get to have a single target environment, in Internet Explorer — JavaScript expressions in CSS, VML and HTML+TIME, and no compatibility issues with other browsers. It'll also work out of the box on nearly 90% of the computers in the world without installing anything else -- no "runtimes", no "installers", no extra code required. Just do it.
Does this sound like a stupid thing to say?
Then it sounds just as stupid when people say it about Adobe AIR.
Of course it's easier to develop HTML apps when you have only one target environment. The problem is that that environment is still controlled by one company.
Those of you about to say "but, but, but, AIR is cross-platform! fight the evil that is Windows!", feel free to replace "Internet Explorer" and "HTA" above with "Firefox" and "xulrunner" or "Prism".
Update: it has been correctly pointed out to me that this post was a bit harsh. I had a headache and was up early, is my excuse. While I absolutely stand by the points made here (AIR is no more the Open Web than Internet Explorer HTAs are; why do people who hate HTAs love AIR?), I should have been more gentlemanly about the point. Throwing bricks helps no-one. My apologies, Mike.
Comments
Robin
John Drinkwater
Quite right.
Gavin
I agree after having to work with HTAs all day.
This stuff just gets painful after a while.
Justyb
Too true. However, Mozilla's platform just isn't bringing anything to the table that's going to entice people to come. Animated SVG support being one in my book. I feel you when you talk about AIR. I too hate Flash / AIR and all that goes with it, but the next best thing isn't going to make people make the jump.
sil
Justyb: that's fine, and I agree with you. I have no problem with people saying "there are various ways of using HTML to build a desktop app, and I believe AIR is the best one because X, Y, Z". It's where people trumpet AIR as this genuinely new exciting thing that just wasn't possible before, as opposed to just the best current example of a thing that loads of people are trying to do.
Rob
I'm no more interested in AIR than I am Microsoft stuff either. I prefer to learn how to write HTML. Maybe these other people should, too.
Jonathan Snook
I was playing with HTAs back in the day and definitely liked the idea of an HTML application with elevated status. And yes, I'd say Adobe AIR is the best platform going right now for cross-platform "web-based" desktop applications.
But I'm not anti-corporate just as long as they do it well. I don't mind buying Robertson screwdrivers over Philips, if it does a better job.
James
Justyb: You realise Mozilla committed support for animated SVG just this week?
Tom Trenka
Hey Stuart:
Thank you for at least taking the time to update the post ;) But I'll just point something out here...Mike isn't really "trumpeting" this, nor did he ever make a judgement within his post about AIR's superiority over something. We happen to be working on an AIR app at the moment, and we've been feeling like it's refreshing to not be dealing with browser incompatibilities.
We definitely don't disagree with you about your AIR vs. Open Web points; trash away on that one!
http://ian.mckellar.org/
I'd argue that HTA is a significantly more Open Web platform than AIR. HTA is based on a set of standard technologies (HTML, JavaScript, CSS) that have been extended to provide the kind of functionality you expect from a native application. That said, the platform limitations make them not interesting to me personally, but if I was deploying Windows-only custom enterprise software I would totally go for HTA over AIR.
It's yet another case of Microsoft coming up with great technology significantly before the Silicon Valley / alpha-nerd contingent "invented" it. HTA was launched with IE5 in March 1999, AIR was released February 25th 2008, almost exactly nine years later.
Of course, I'm not going to go and use HTA, I just think that it's very weird that "failed" MS technologies get reinvented ten years later as RIAs or AJAX or Desktop Widgets or whatever. There's some smart people up in Redmond creating amazing technology. I just never notice it till it's too late.
rascunho » Blog Archive » links for 2009-01-22
[...] as days pass by, by Stuart Langridge — Working with Internet Explorer Building HTA desktop apps with Internet Explorer is a real treat for a web developer. (tags: www.kryogenix.org 2009 mes0 dia22 HTA Air JavaScript_Applications) [...]
sil
Tom: well put. I think what riles me the most is the point I was (inexpertly) trying to make in the first paragraph of the original post: if I'd genuinely written that first paragraph as a post, do you think people would have said "wow, blimey, he's right, what a great Open Web technology way of deploying apps on the desktop"? Or do you think people would have said: are you a stupid person? Why would you want to use Internet Explorer for anything? Don't be a moron?
I suspect it would have been the latter, and I genuinely don't see AIR as being anything different: hence my puzzlement at the difference in reaction.
Brandon
> it sounds just as stupid when people say it about Adobe AIR
Isn't it actually slightly *more* stupid to say your HTA/IE bit about Adobe Air, particularly the "no 'runtimes', no 'installers', no extra code required" part? I mean, for the HTA/IE example, at least it's true.
Tom Trenka
Stuart: I think it would really depend on the questioner's background (i.e. blogger type vs. enterprise type) but yeah, I hear you. In all fairness though, working with AIR has been pretty nice, and you don't have to buy any of Adobe's products to make it work.
I'm not endorsing it as something better than the Open Web but I do have to give them some kudos for trying it on. And they do seem to be heading in the Open Web direction (though we'll see, we've all been down *that* road before ;))...
I will say though that it's a lot easier working with AIR than it was working with HTAs...at least you don't have to dive into ActiveX/VB/C# land when you're working on it.
Not that that's any major consolation ;)
sil
Tom: agreed on pretty much all your points :)
One thing that does disappoint me, because I'm one of them openness hippies, is that there's a real possibility for there to be a "general OS API" exported to HTML. If, say, Adobe had said "we're building this thing called AIR, which will allow you to make desktop apps from HTML, and the API for your apps to talk to the OS needs the following stuff" and then got together with Microsoft (for HTAs) and Apple (for Dashboard) and Mozilla (for Prism) and Palm (for WebOS) and the TitaniumApp people and whatnot, then they might have hashed out a mutual API to do this sort of thing. As it is, there are half a dozen ways to do this and they're all similar but different. It's irritating, because everyone's locked into own-the-format-own-the-future thinking, which I'm sure is great for them when it works but isn't great for consumers...
Robert Nyman
I really enjoyed this! We had this talk just the other day, that something which was wildly hated a few years ago is ok now - just with a different name on it...
Me
The biggest thing holding back the further development of the internet and computers in general is the fact that we do not have just 1 standard browser and 1 standard operating system.
These two are vital for offering diversity in software.
Diversity is a good thing but NOT in the software environment (operating platform/browser).
Amen brother.